The Miracle of The Timeless Soul With Patrick Belisle

The Miracle of The Timeless Soul With Patrick Belisle
(Please note: This transcript was computer generated, and has not been edited for accuracy.)

[00:00:00] Bree: This week is one of my favorite weeks of the year because we are coming up on the winter solstice, which -means that in North America, the days will begin getting longer again After the 21st, so I am so excited. My husband likes to tease me because in the summer solstice when everyone is rejoicing the beginning of summer, I always have a little pang of sadness because I know that.

[00:00:39] Gradually the days are getting shorter. 

[00:00:43] So you can see why that makes me really love the winter solstice. Today. Jeff said that it reminded him of a song called Seattle and it has a line in it that goes something like. Am I an optimist or am I a pessimist? If I see the glass half full. Of emptiness. 

[00:01:07] Yeah, that's that's pretty much me. I think I'm an optimist, but I leave it to you to decide. In any case, I enjoy the winter solstice . It's a really special time for so many people of all different faiths. And I wanted to lean into the mystical side of. 

[00:01:30] The winter solstice. By having a conversation. About time. With a very spiritual person. 

[00:01:41] Bree: So today, I. Especially excited to share with you this conversation with my friend Patrick Belisle patrick is a practical mystic, a nonprofit executive, a teacher in every way, and a world traveler. He studied business and theology 

[00:02:06] with Benedictine monks at his Minnesota college. 

[00:02:10] Bree: He meditated with Buddhist monks in Thailand and he had a mystical experience at the Osho Commune in India on a one year trip around the world with his incredible wife, Jane. As they searched for the meaning of life, they wandered North America three more years after that and chose Charlottesville as their perfect place to finally settle down.

[00:02:38] For decades. Pat has been lecturing and raising money for Edgar Cayce's Association for Research and Enlightenment, the a r E in Virginia Beach, the University of Virginia Division of Perceptual Studies, which we call dopps, which is researching the nature of consciousness, the United Way, uva, children's Hospitals.

[00:03:03] And dozens of other charities and nonprofit organizations. He is also married over 50 couples as a celebrant and his practice hypnotherapy, including past life regressions with hundreds of. Pat enjoys nothing more than sharing his wisdom and love of life with everyone he meets, and I feel really lucky to have crossed paths with him and to be able to share his story with you on this very, very special week.

[00:03:38] Before I get started with Pat, though, I want to remind you, I have gotten so much incredible feedback about the rehearsal room. So the rehearsal room is an online community. We'll meet once a week where we can rehearse together. 

[00:03:57] And rehearsing means experimenting, sharing, getting feedback, taking risks. Mapping out a plan and yes. Practicing, whatever it is that you're working on. 

[00:04:12] Bree: Whether that's an audition piece, a TED talk, a difficult conversation, an elevator pitch.

[00:04:20] Uh, Proposal, a wedding toast, all the things, whatever you would like a little more support in really working through before you take it into the world. The rehearsal room will be a supportive space to do that. I'll offer coaching but you'll also have the advantage of getting feedback from a supportive 

[00:04:47] private group. So applications for the rehearsal room are open, today is Monday, December 19th, and if you apply by the 20th, that's tomorrow. Then you'll also get a bonus workshop with me on setting your intentions for 2020. So go to the lovely un becoming.com, check it out the rehearsal room, and apply today.

[00:05:17] And here is a beautiful and mystical conversation about time with my dear friend Pat Belisle.

[00:05:28] Bree: Hello. It's 

[00:05:29] so nice to be in person with you . And on cold dreary day, it's nice to be with someone so warm thank you. In a cozy little space. 

[00:05:36] Thank 

[00:05:37] Patrick: you. I'm gonna give you a hug after this . 

[00:05:38] Bree: I love it. let's just get right into it. If you feel good with that, please. as you know, I've been really obsessed with time lately, I've been, yeah. I've been doing a real deep dive into it and I wanted to touch base with you because of your. , beautiful blend of the mystical and the pragmatic that I just find so compelling and exciting to be around.

[00:06:09] And so I just wanted to start with. What does time mean? for you? Just a small little question, . 

[00:06:17] Patrick: Oh yeah. Not going too deeply into the philosophy of it. Right. Yeah. And you know, as we age, time is something I think about often. Yeah. And uh, as you know, I've done everything from past life regression, so-called and work with people that.

[00:06:36] work, research into kids who seem to remember a past life. . so terms around time are all around me all day long in, in work that I do and things I think about. But, I'm open to anything you want to throw at me from, holographic universes to, all time being simultaneous to,for me, a lot of this came up.

[00:06:59] I, I was raised Catholic. Yeah. And, we're taught about the. , That we're each a soul, a human being with a immortal soul. Mm-hmm. , but they never explained in Catholicism where the soul was before. Mm-hmm. this life. And it wasn't until I went to college and read Plato and his conversations with Socrates about the immortality of the soul, where,he really got me thinking about that question.

[00:07:28] Patrick: Where were we before this? . And , they have some good things to say about it, but, my work. More recently with Edgar Cayce and this group at the University of Virginia, the division of perceptual studies have a lot better answers than Catholics or the Greeks had for us. So that's a long way to say I think about time a lot, and I'm happy to go wherever you want to go with 

[00:07:52] Bree: it.

[00:07:52] almost immediately. , we went from time to the soul. . 

[00:07:58] Patrick: Yeah. Welcome to my life. my wife. Jane. Yeah. gives me a hard time about going to cocktail parties and . I'll go right from football, talk to the soul or the weather to the soul

[00:08:11] So don't be surprised. ,

[00:08:13] I mean, for me it's, it really is about meaning. my, I wake up in the morning and I, my first thought is I'm alive. I'm so glad to be alive again.

[00:08:22] I have another day on the planet and I don't wanna take it for granted. I don't wanna waste it. I want to figure out what the hell's going on here, , and how to be a good person and how to be happy and how to help others. And, so I just, like to live in big questions, what's the purpose of life and what brings meaning to us and all that.

[00:08:42] yeah, why go to a cocktail party and stay on the surface? 

[00:08:46] Bree: I agree. So as your understanding of the soul has evolved, what do you think of it now? 

[00:08:54] Patrick: Mm-hmm.thanks to the Edgar Cayce readings and this group at the University of Virginia. I've come to think about the soul more as consciousness, the unchanging part of ourselves that's not just our ego mind or our thought in this present moment, but the timeless nature of self and. , in Edgar Cayce's world, there's a few dimensions.

[00:09:20] There's, there is that ego self. Then underneath that is the subconscious mind or unconscious mind. And below that, those first two are like Freud and young. they agree with that part. But then Edgar Cayce adds another dimension of mind, which the Hindus also have, which is the soul mind. and that's the part that is timeless that I'm talking about where.

[00:09:40] there are veils between the conscious and unconscious and then the unconscious and this soul mind that prevent us from knowing about or remembering our past lives, for instance. and then there's another veil way down under that, that between our individual selves or our individual souls consciousness and that collective unconscious that Jung talks about that allows me to tap into you or anybody.

[00:10:07] on the planet or who's ever lived. back to that idea of time. , and that's something Edgar Cayce himself could do in this unconscious state. I don't know how much you know about his story, but,he put himself into a trance essentially, and, didn't remember anything that came through him while he was in that trance.

[00:10:23] But his wife would lead what they called a reading and he would give this information. That he was not consciously aware of. he could tap into someone, like I say, across the country, around the world, and tell you exactly what was going on with them, their physical attributes, their blood pressure at the moment, et cetera, et cetera.

[00:10:43] And tap into their past lives as well. And tell them, tell, you, tell them, why this situation was happening in their current life, how it. a result of things that had happened in past lives that were just coming forward to this moment to help them learn this soul lesson. Really fascinating stuff.

[00:11:03] But the idea is that, we all can tap into that collective unconscious,the timeless, eternal, if you will. And some people do it through meditation practices, I guess. Uh,sometimes we do it through our dreams, by accident, if you will. but Mr. Cayce could do it whenever he wanted to by going into that trance 

[00:11:26] Bree: and practicing.

[00:11:28] practicing that, developing that skill. 

[00:11:30] Patrick: Yeah. his came from past life. that ability, the readings said , but yes, that's right. Any of us can practice our meditation and watching our dreams for meaning and availing ourselves of past life regression therapy. there's a lot of different ways that we can potentially tap into that sort of thing.

[00:11:49] And 

[00:11:50] Bree: you help people. Tap into their past lives. You do past life regression, therapeutic work. That's right. 

[00:11:55] Patrick: Yeah. yeah. I've done hundreds, if not thousands of past life regressions for people, both individuals, and I've done some group sessions as well, and they're very powerful. I take, I keep coming back to Edgar Cayce.

[00:12:10] I come from his perspective that I don't just do it for people who are curious. Their past lives. I do it for therapy really. If they're looking for insight into a relationship or a behavior or a pattern that doesn't seem to make sense logically, you know,why do I always get attracted to that kind of person?

[00:12:30] , or why am I, whatever the situation is. So before we do a progression together, I always have them think about what they want insight into in their current life, and then I do this regression, which, has them in a relaxed state and they, their own unconscious mind chooses the time and place and the situation.

[00:12:52] I don't do, I don't give them any cues about that. And whatever comes through them, I trust is what they. to be experiencing at the moment and learning from. And, we, I try to guide them into doing some understanding work, some forgiveness work, and then, incorporating that into their own unconscious mind, so that they'll remember it, for the rest of their lives and have learned from it.

[00:13:15] Patrick: When they go into the next situation, , and it's painless, it's cheap, it's it's amazing and so powerful. My first one that, that really meant something to me was I was handed my own life purpose, through a regression. So in other words, it was my higher self telling me my purpose, which is to teach those who want to learn to love.

[00:13:38] so succinct and so resonated with me so much. It wasn't somebody else telling me it was through a past life regression, 

[00:13:45] Bree: It was a 

[00:13:45] Patrick: higher self. yeah. An aspect of my higher self. That's right. and a past self. . Yeah. maybe and that's why that's this whole thing, right? I, even in my, past life regression training, they talk about the fact that it, it may or may not be an actual past life memory.

[00:14:00] It might be if this universe really is a hologram and everything that's ever happened is already recorded, let's just say, it might just be me tapping into the life of someone else who has lived and. some wisdom to share with my situation. that may or not, may or may not have been me in air quotes, but an aspect of that oneness of consciousness.

[00:14:23] I'm open to all sorts of possibilities. I tell my clients too that. . It may also just be your unconscious mind putting meaningful information into symbolic form, like a dream. one in one of my regressions I did, that I had done for myself, I was, I died by being run over by, I don't remember if it was horses or cows or what, but some kind of animals.

[00:14:43] Patrick: I was run, I was stampeded. to death. . and I remember thinking, maybe, or in that same lifetime it was, I had an affair and that was my big lesson about, , choosing loyalty or something else. And so was, it was just symbolic of my animal passions running over me.

[00:15:04] You see what I mean? like that. That's what killed me in the end was my, I couldn't control my wild animal. . The animal Purs. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. 

[00:15:12] Bree: what also strikes me about that is that if it, if the animals that were stampeding or horses or cows, they're also the animals that we try to yolk and harness.

[00:15:21] That's true and put to work for us. it's you're good at this. What a beautiful. . thank you for sharing the story. It's fun to think about it. and it's very intimate and personal. thinking of a past life regression as being meaningful in a multitude of ways that may not be a literal past life.

[00:15:39] Mm-hmm. opens it up for me in a really gorgeous way, cuz my skeptical brain just can't quite. Grasp it. . Yeah. Yeah, for sure. and 

[00:15:51] Patrick: that's okay. And I think absolutely. Yeah. I, that's how I am too in the world, honestly. I had a mystical experience back in 1994 that changed me forever, but I also, thank goodness, came back intact with my, my left brain intact, let's say my critical thinking mind.

[00:16:13] So even though I knew. subjectively, I had been changed. there was no doubt about it, but objectively I wondered still if I was crazy or like, how do you put it in context? Has this happened to other people, et cetera. So I came back. Cause this happened in India. I came back to the States, doing some research, to see, do other people have mystical experiences?

[00:16:37] Psychic experiences, what does it mean? How does it, how is it possible? And in that research, that's where I found Edgar Cayce. And it's where I found the University of Virginia Division of perceptual Studies. Here were these scientists. , MDs, PhDs, et cetera, doing rigorous research into things like near death experiences, psychic phenomena, mystical experiences out-of-body experiences, and children who seem to remember a past life and just like them.

[00:17:08] I've learned a lot from them. One of, one thing I've learned is, you really can't trust your own experience. And, another thing is you, their job is to gain the evidence, put together the evidence, but they do not ever talk about proof that this proves life after death, or this proves the existence of something like a soul.

[00:17:29] they're just collecting the data. Now they're, they happen to have 2,500 cases of kids who seem to remember past life. But when the first book was published on that, by Dr. Ian Stevenson, who started the division, he called it 20 cases suggestive. of Reincarnation. , because he was still open to the possibility of it being something else.

[00:17:48] But the only theory that seemed to make sense. Reincarnation. . But see then that brings in some other religions that seem to believe in reincarnation and that's not where they wanted to go with it. They're not talking about religion or God, it's just trying to understand how the universe works.

[00:18:04] I love that it has divorced, sort of the human hubris from as much as possible, we have egocentrism anyway, but data are so mutable and and can be interpreted in myriad ways. Exactly. So how can we know Exactly. We can't. we can only learn and. Evolve and keep thinking about it in different 

[00:18:28] Patrick: ways. That's right. And applying the scientific method.

[00:18:30] That's the beautiful thing about, these scientists,invite that in, that the problem or the people that, that. present the problems with groups. Research groups like this are the cynics. , the people that won't even look at the research, because they, quote unquote know that it can't be real.

[00:18:47] because it doesn't fit into their paradigm. And we're talking about physicalist or materialist scientist who, again, your quotes know. , when the brain stops, you die. And there's nothing that goes on period. . And so they won't even look at the possibility of a near death experience where someone says that they have hadn an experience while their brain was flatlined.

[00:19:10] or, kids that seem to remember a past life, that's just impossible. I'm not even gonna look at the evidence. , wait a second. now you're, who's the scientist here? You're not even gonna examine 

[00:19:20] Bree: the evidence. Yeah. And then on the other side of that, and I actually have been meaning to ask you this for a while, is, are the people who,blindly go because we're so desperate.

[00:19:32] we so want to make meaning of our lives and our experiences that sometimes I think we can get pulled into, I would say cultish, communities and experiences. Mm-hmm.and I just wonder what do you think about that and what are some strategies to be sure that we're being careful as we move towards healers and mystics?

[00:19:56] Bree: How do we make sure that we're not being hurt? 

[00:19:59] that's, yeah, good question. in my case, I. Went right to the research to, to, because I knew the dangers of, wanting to believe in miracles or whatever you yeah. As you say, the sort of the cultish stuff, and I mentioned I was raised Catholic and you know, I mean Catholicism and Christianity.

[00:20:20] Patrick: sorry, listeners, but it is the biggest cult on the planet in the sense that it's personality based, Jesus is worshiped as a God, and and people do give up their critical thinking at some level and to believe in miracles and, the trans. trans substantiation, it's called that this is the body and blood of Christ, et cetera.

[00:20:43] and that whether it's Christianity or a guru in India or whatever else, other belief system yeah, you can, giving up our own critical thinking can lead to some destructive consequences. I don't exactly know what pattern or what path people can follow. to avoid falling into it.

[00:21:02] . But I'll just say keep your critical mind thinking. people ask me all the time, do you believe in reincarnation? and I always say I'm open to the possibility. but I'm always looking at the evidence. Cuz as a Catholic I was given the catechism, which is, here's what we believe, here's the way the world with the universe works.

[00:21:21] Patrick: And. , I had questions beyond those answers and, uh, that's, that's not okay, let's just say, or just, just here, just memorize this and mm-hmm. know that that's the way the world, and, and once I learned that there's answers beyond what I was given in Catholicism, I told myself essentially that I'll never again accept

[00:21:44] that I know anything for sure. , whether it's truth, beauty, or love, the Greek's, big three aspects of the Creator. All of those things are relative, truth itself, there is no one universal truth. All truth is relative Love is relative. Beauty is relative, So 

[00:22:03] what I hear then is that discernment.

[00:22:06] Bree: right. Discernment is a skill. Mm-hmm. to continue to develop so that we can stay open to possibilities. Yeah. And we can learn from the different teachers, whether they are scientists or mystics or both. Mm-hmm. spiritual guide. Parents , right? , yeah. That we can learn without having to take on one particular belief system of another.

[00:22:38] Yeah. as being the whole, 

[00:22:40] Patrick: it's true. That's a great way to say it. Yeah. And I, for me, community helps a lot with that too. putting people like you in your circle, who will be supportive. And open and at the same time will keep me in check , like they won't, you wouldn't let me go too far down a path of whatever Cultism, let's say.

[00:23:00] and so community, like I say, helped me a bunch. I have the Dopps community, that's the, this uva, division of perceptual study. They just go by DOPS. 

[00:23:10] I'll, I'll link them in the show notes Perfect too. I think people will really enjoy looking into their 

[00:23:14] Patrick: work. Perfect. . So Dopps has its community, let's say, people that are open to these things but are doing the research.

[00:23:22] So they, that's been really helpful to me to be tapped into that community. And at the same time I've been part of this Edgar Cayce community. It, the organization he started is called the Association for Research and Enlightenment, the a r e based in Virginia Beach. And there are tens of thousands of members of that organization and.

[00:23:43] we have conferences and travel and, all this and they're people at the a r e are much more. Of the true believer perspective. , and yet research is the middle name of the organization. So they're also, wanting to learn and explore and test. not just swallow it whole.

[00:24:02] Patrick: Let's say that's Edgar Cayce himself in the readings often said the idea is to try it out, Try this out in your life and if it makes you a better person, keep it. , if it doesn't let it go, Yeah. Experimentation is, a major tene of my life. and that's exactly the way that I try.

[00:24:22] Bree: I don't know that I always succeed. Sure. But I really try to, I be curious to ask questions, to look at different modalities for exploring those questions and then to really evaluate what have I learned from this, and also where are the limits of this for me. like I said, I don't do it all the time, but I really do try.

[00:24:45] It's been a that's great. a fun way of looking at whether it's. , oh, do I wanna go study acupuncture, , or, or how do I get to Santa Fe, from here? . anyways, 

[00:24:58] Patrick: you've had a lot of opportunity as a mom also to, to show your kids your, philosophy, let's say, around experimenting.

[00:25:06] So I, I just think it's really valuable, like you modeling that for. younger people. 

[00:25:11] Bree: Oh, that's kind. They might see it as being the Guinea pigs. The, . Yeah. Maybe the rats in my lab 

[00:25:16] Patrick: Maybe, but that, for most of us, who aren't tapped into a worldwide community like this group, the research group at the University of Virginia, or even the a r e, our worlds, our households, our, what we eat, how we live our lives, how we model it for our children, et cetera.

[00:25:35] Well done. I, I think if everybody could see , that example. Yeah. I come back to my own mom in particular, we were talking about life purpose before, and one of the things she would do often is tell me my birth story. And this ended up really giving me a sense of purpose in my life because I was born without a heartbeat and they had to resuscitate.

[00:26:00] And so from that point on, she always believed, and this is what she told me, that God had a special purpose for me, a plan. And that, that I was saved for a, for this special purpose. Now, if every kid on this planet had some sense that they were special and unique and had a purpose.

[00:26:25] I'm telling you, we would be living in a different world because from childhood, I was always seeking my purpose. and because I was raised in the Catholic church and I took that seriously, I was always looking to express my higher ideals, , I was exploring a life of service and how I could be a better person, more kind and loving 

[00:26:45] Bree: and so those two things combined really filled me with this sense of purpose, man, I'm, I am here. To do something, It's a really beautiful and dramatic story, which I love 

[00:27:01] Patrick: Lynn. It's about mom , 

[00:27:02] Bree: but second of all, it, I think it does, it, it gives a nice takeaway, which is that as parents, it's really powerful for us to, and I would say imperative for us to share with our children.

[00:27:19] the story of their birth, which is dramatic for every child. There is nothing about childbirth that is not absolutely a miracle and a drama. And terrifying. Yeah. And extraordinary. Yeah. 

[00:27:36] Patrick: It's funny, a lot of. , I shouldn't say. A lot of, some mothers,will use that birth story when it's time to guilt their children into something

[00:27:45] . You, I was in labor for 48 hours to get you on this planet. go clean your rooms, don't talk back here, you owe me kinda thing. which is totally valid, don't get me wrong, . But, and I would absolutely do it. but yes, to the bigger point, that birth story, can really.

[00:28:01] Patrick: Give that meaning to kids. By the way,that also reminded me of another lesson I've learned over time, which is, somewhere along the line, I realized that instead of life happening to me, life is happening for me. and this came more or less from these Edgar Cayce readings where, you know, he, his life or life, what do we call it?

[00:28:20] Worldview, I guess. as karma as part of it, and being responsible for every, as he said, every jot and every tittle. of your existence, every choice you make, et cetera, has a consequence.. 

[00:28:31] So in Catholicism, a lot of times we focus on the victimhood, let's say. and martyrdom, crucify me, Yes. Let me be of service. Let's put my own needs aside. I'll do it for you. but then you're a little resentful.

[00:28:46] Patrick: Let's just say resentful. Doing that. And so I definitely for myself had, a bit of victimhood, which again, to me was always trained into me as being sacred, if you will, or whatever Holy but once I understood karma and this idea that we're all responsible for our actions in the world and our words and our thoughts, it came much more clear to me that.

[00:29:12] this moment is happening for me to benefit me, to teach me what I need as a soul, as a consciousness, whatever. This is what I've brought on myself. Learn from it. Make different choices this time. React differently. React ideally with love and compassion as opposed to ego. revenge or whatever, you And that was a huge shift for me. That is a huge shift. And if we can all get around to really seeing life is happening for us, not to us. 

[00:29:44] and that's even, that's super powerful to me, that life is happening for us. Life is happening for life. Right. And. It is for me, but it's for me as part of the collective, which then also I think brings us back to something that I really want to talk about with you because I know nothing about it and I feel like you can.

[00:30:12] Bree: educate me on this, which is something that you mentioned earlier, the holographic nature of time. , . 

[00:30:20] Patrick: So this is definitely not my specialty, but 

[00:30:23] Bree: I or what it means for you. 

[00:30:24] yeah. I've grappled with it over the years and heard it as a concept, Stephen Hawking and, there's so many brilliant people who.

[00:30:34] Patrick: put this idea out there and tried to help the rest of us understand it, in a brief history of time. his book. but I only get so far with that. me too. Do you remember Richard Bach? Yeah. Who wrote, Jonathan, Jonathan Livingston, Siegel Illusions, and so many other great books.

[00:30:49] He wrote a book called One, which also helped me with the idea and he. use this analogy of being up in a plane, and looking down on the earth and seeing, essentially, in my mind, it's like a big ball of yarn. and every. strand, let's say, is one of the, our potential paths in life. But then every time we make a different choice, a whole new path starts off from that and your path overlaps with mine, et cetera, et cetera.

[00:31:16] and it's all this big ball of yarn. Like I say, it's all one, it's all tied together. we seemingly are apart, but we really are. Different aspects of this same divine oneness, divine consciousness. So it's impossible to describe. So we all look for these metaphors to, to help paint the picture, and that was a helpful one to me.

[00:31:38] Bree: think What it makes me think about with regards to what you said earlier, which is that life is happening for us. life is happening for us across time. 

[00:31:51] Patrick: too. Mm-hmm. . . 

[00:31:53] Bree: Yeah. Like, I can't even, I, I'm a seeker, right? I'm a seeker. , I'm not a scientist. 

[00:31:57] Patrick: Yeah. Same. I know.

[00:31:58] And that's why I'm saying these analogies, these metaphors help me a bunch with, have you read, it's a very short story called the. 

[00:32:06] Bree: I have read the egg, and you know what I'm, 

[00:32:08] Patrick: its weir, I think is how 

[00:32:10] you 

[00:32:10] Bree: say it. Yeah. I think there's a YouTube video of it.

[00:32:13] Oh, cool. Too. All right. 

[00:32:14] Patrick: I'll have to check that out. he's describing exactly this, right? that this entity, this soul, this point of consciousness is looking back on what he perceives. The life he just left and this entity that's with him, whatever we want to call that observer, the God consciousness, is pointing out that , not only was that his life, but so was that and so was that, and so was that.

[00:32:40] You'll have another chance to go back in there and even says in that description that it's not. sequential, that you might not go forward to a next life. You might go backward to a life in the 15th century or . whatever. It's, but eventually you will have lived all the possible lives your own self because I am you and you are me, and we're all tied together in that oneness.

[00:33:06] So yeah, there's some mind boggling concepts out there that really help me make sense. , a lot of the things that happened to me, like I keep coming back to that mystical experience I had in 1994, which was a oneness experience where I was not separate from others or anything around me. I was, everything I , it's impossible to describe, but.

[00:33:33] But a very real feeling and understanding. 

[00:33:36] Bree: do you feel comfortable sharing more about that ? 

[00:33:38] Patrick: Sure. Yeah. I, in a situation like this, I'm happy to do that. , I tend not to at , the cocktail parties, mm-hmm. .. But, yeah. so Jane and I we were in our late twenties and had gotten to a point in our lives where we had 

[00:33:53] checked all the boxes on the American list of to-dos, we've gone to college, we got married, we had good jobs. We were making decent money and yet we were both feeling unfulfilled. and so we decided to take our nest egg, which wasn't much, $20,000 at the time, and cash it in on a trip around the world for one year looking.

[00:34:15] The meaning of life. . And so we went and we meditated with Buddhist monks in Thailand and went to this, ashram in India for what ended up being about a month. And, it was there that I had this mystical experience at the OSHO Commune. Anyway, , I took this class called opening to emotions, and it uses, it used breath.

[00:34:37] she called it pulsation therapy. but essentially they used breathwork to get you into an altered state of consciousness. And then we did some forgiveness exercises and, it's very internal. There were probably 15 of us in the class. We were all laying on the floor being guided by this teacher.

[00:34:53] And, you know, while I was in this altered state of consciousness doing this emotional work, I was crying and then I was laughing and it just, it felt. Freeing and wonderful. and then after the laughing and crying, I was just in this beautiful state of peace laying on the ground there, and out of nowhere, this blueish purple light just filled me, filled everything, and it was just pure, unconditional love.

[00:35:22] And whatever was me disappeared. . And yet in that same moment I could, again, this, I have to use words and they don't apply exactly. Mm-hmm. ,, but I could see everything in the room. I was aware of every person. I could see them laying in this sort of circle around me, even in this bluish purple love light.

[00:35:46] . And I knew what was happening with them. Like I could have a sense of what they were all going through , and again, I keep using words like I, but there was no I . I was just presence, I was unconditional love. And at the same time, I also became acutely aware of the fact that everything, and I mean everything was exactly as it should be, and that it didn't matter if I was king of the world.

[00:36:19] Patrick: Or if I was in prison that I was always taken care of and it was just so beautiful. and I, of course, I wish everybody could experience something like this, just this pure love that we're all connected to at all times. And I have no idea how long I was in that state. the time was suspended, it was suspend.

[00:36:45] Yeah. You hear that often with mystical type experiences. Uh, but you know, our teacher brought us back and I opened my eyes and knew something had happened and then I was changed and Jane was elsewhere in the commune. So I went looking for her. And I remember walking through the. The paths of the commune and noticing the leaves on the tree looked greener and sharper, crisper and the sounds like I could hear the birds like I'd never heard before, and I just felt so much more alive and again, just changed very deeply.

[00:37:22] What I didn't realize was that metaphysical experience had also had physical effects. My, my eyesight, which had been 2035, , it turns out, was now 2015. So my eyesight had improved my hearing. when I went to the doctor a few years later, he said, haven't you ever been to a rock concert? I said, yeah, man.

[00:37:44] was lead singer in a rock band. I went, mon went to Monsters of Rock back in the eighties. . I said, why? He said, cuz you have the hearing of a seven year old. your drums don't. Sign of normal wear and tear. So there were these physical healings, if you will, that came from that metaphysical experience.

[00:38:02] Patrick: So these are the kind of things I'm saying. I knew that I was changed, but there was no way to prove anything or I knew it wasn't normal, so I had to go looking for these unusual experiences and other people that may have experienced something like it to try to tell me. , this is somehow normal or it can be explained through X, Y, and Z.

[00:38:24] Bree: and that's it. Oh, what an incredible story. Thank you for sharing it. You're welcome. I have a couple of things that have come to mind hearing it. Number one is that I have been talking to my friend. I have a good. , Kelsey Johnson, who is an astronomer, a brilliant mind, and she and I take walks not quite often enough, but I'm always really appreciate them.

[00:38:54] And lately she's been studying, researching, exploring, and teaching the importance of. awe . . And when you describe your experience, I think of how incredibly in the truest sense of the word awesome. . Mm-hmm. and awful full. How that experience is that mm-hmm. and. I experience, we all experience. If we open ourselves up to a tiny bit of that, when we look at the night sky, just looking at the stars.

[00:39:37] Mm-hmm. If we are lucky enough to be in a place where light pollution is not destroying our ability to truly take in the night sky, then we get a tiny little taste of that. , but in the experience that you were talking about, you are the night sky. You are the stars, you are the dust, you are 

[00:40:01] Patrick: the light.

[00:40:02] That's right. Yeah. As above, so below. Mm-hmm. , they, they say. So as much universe as there is out there, there's that much and more to explore inside. The trick for most of us is just making time and finding ways to get there. So meditation, hypnotherapy, dreams. the, there are some paths inward yoga.

[00:40:24] if, youpotentially in the Yoga Sutra he gave us a path to enlightenment more or less. if you just do this, then you go to the next level and you go . And there's a lot of those gurus that, I think about Yoa and self-realization fellowship.

[00:40:38] Patrick: There's a lot of. people that are out there giving us hints of how to do that inner exploration. but I like that, that the absolutely, the easy one is to go out at night and look at the stars and just to get 

[00:40:49] Bree: a little and do some breath work at the same time. That's what I would do . Breath work is, definitely.

[00:40:56] my jam. Hmm. for great, for getting to that deeper place. But I think that we all have different ways and I think it also speaks to something else, which is that it's a deeply individual path. Absolutely. And I'm sure that while other people were moved in that class, not everyone had that particular experience and.

[00:41:20] and sometimes we get in the way of those experience for the 

[00:41:23] Patrick: wanting. Oh, you have no idea. yeah, I mean after you have an experience like that, I'll just say it this way. Yeah. After I had my experience, I absolutely craved to get back there. and have it again lived there. you hear that all the time from people that have near death experiences.

[00:41:38] They experience this oneness and bliss and love and. They have to go back in their body and experience pain and suffering and separation. No way. But there they go. They come back in and, yeah, so many of us then try to recreate it. I don't know. I think it wasn't it Ron Doss who, had a trip of some kind that, just he wanted to recreate and re-experience.

[00:42:01] Bree: And anyway, so many of us just, uh,Keep seeking. this actually brings me to that second question that I had, which is that you have, in many ways devoted your life to the integration of that experience. And I'm just wondering what. , what did you do in the days and weeks that followed

[00:42:26] Patrick: You're very perceptive, Brie, so as you're getting at,I was changed and could not go back to my normal. Routine. We were living in Olympia, Washington at the time. I was raising money for the Evergreen State College. , and tried to go back and just didn't fit anymore, even at a hippie college like Evergreen.

[00:42:44] I, I just was changed and started going out and meditating in the woods and just whatever, experiencing life more deeply. And, and finally I came to Jane and said, that year around the world was so life-changing, and that mystical experience in particular showed me that we're always taken care of.

[00:43:05] Patrick: So I have no fear of whatever we fear, running outta money, ending up whatever, homeless and abandoned and or sick or whatever our fears are. I didn't have any of that anymore. And Somehow talk Jane into , jumping into our little Honda Civic with no air conditioning and wandering North America, which we ended up doing almost three years. And we'd run out of money every couple months or come close to it and be like, okay, where do you wanna go? Explore? let's go to Maine this summer. We'd never been to Maine. Let's get jobs, wait tables and whatever on the water and have a nice summer and save up a couple thousand bucks.

[00:43:43] Jump back in the car, wander some more. So we did that for, like I say, three years. And at the end of that, we found Charlottesville when we both started feeling like it was time to settle down, Charlottesville is where all the doors opened, and it ended up being our perfect place. And that was 25 years ago.

[00:44:00] We, we've stayed settled here happily, but yes, we in those years after I'd been changed like that, I, I. Just go back to living in the box 

[00:44:13] Bree: and how wonderful that you were in a relationship that could grow with you. 

[00:44:18] Patrick: Oh, in that, it's really unbelievable. Yeah. That, that Jane was willing to take the trip around the world in the first place and then she was ready to pull up roots and wander like that.

[00:44:29] Yeah. It's. you're right. I, we, neither one of us takes it for granted. , 

[00:44:32] Bree: I need to have Jane on to get her . 

[00:44:34] Patrick: yeah. Experience. You'll definitely love this. , you'll definitely get the real story from Jane . 

[00:44:41] Thank you so much for having this conversation today. I really needed to have it.

[00:44:46] Patrick: I've been personally in a place of fear and it helped me to remember the brave space. in there too. That, that we can be brave when we trust and have deep faith. And the faith is not. the momentary, or even in this lifetime, but in the eternal caring for life. My question for you before, before I let you go, , is what is one piece of wisdom that you would like to pass on? in the end, it's all about love. that's what I got from my mystical experience. That's what I got from my mother in her talking about my life purpose. I think each one of us, if we really took the time to look internally and what drives us to behave the way we do, and. Being driven the way we are is we're just looking for love at whatever level that, whether that's approval or security or whatever it is, it's, it just all comes back to being loved and lovable.

[00:45:56] I just went through a process out in California called the Hoffman Process that the Hoffman Institute, I did that in June and Jane just did it in November. And that's exactly what it is. It helps us peel back those layers to, to remember that we. Love, loved lov. 

[00:46:12] Bree: Thank you. Oh, thank you so much for coming on.