Menopause with Friends: Menopausal AF with Lisa Powers Tricomi

Bree: [00:00:00] Today's conversation is with Lisa. Tricomi an actor, a creative arts therapist, and a dear friend of mine for over 20 years. This chat was actually recorded way back in early September. And it was perhaps the first, truly open conversation I had with anyone about menopause.  

I saved it for now. Because this is the final menopause with friends episode, and it just felt right to return to the beginning to wrap this up. Well, I say that it's the last menopause with friends episode. I may take it back, but for now it's the final one. And as I was pulling this together for you.  

There were a couple of things that really struck me. First. Most talk about menopause is incredibly gendered. And for those who have been listening you may have noticed that we've been shifting somewhat from speaking about women in perimenopause. Two people in [00:01:00] perimenopause.  

In this episode, we don't do that. We didn't know then what we know now. I didn't know then what I know now, which is that menopause happens to people. Not just women. And I'm a woman. Lisa is a woman. We're both talking about it from our very gendered perspective and that's fine. But I also just want to acknowledge it.  

Because I hope that this information is useful to all humans who experienced this phase of life.  

And the other thing is that Lisa had some very extreme effects of perimenopause. Physically cognitively. And emotionally really extreme. She actually texted me right after we recorded this episode. And she said, I really hope I didn't scare anybody off. And it's worth noting. Because this conversation does cover some scary stuff.  

But my hope is that you will listen to this. And [00:02:00] feel less alone if you are in perimenopause and you are having feelings that are way off. Feelings that you might not ever think would be associated with perimenopause. Or if you're still having pretty regular periods that you might not even realize could be related to hormonal shifts.  

That you've been largely unaware of. So I said that this is the last menopause with friends episode, but I'm still putting together a final episode for this season. That addresses questions that you still have about perimenopause and menopause. And now I'm super excited because I had this link that you can click on to leave me an audio message.  

The link is in the show notes and in my Instagram bio at the lovelyunbecoming and I'd love to hear from you. I'd really love to hear your questions and also just love to hear your feedback. Let me know if these conversations about perimenopause and menopause. Have changed the way you understand [00:03:00] midlife transitions.  

Because I believe deeply. That by connecting, we can both feel less alone and our own experiences and also have a greater impact collectively on responding to these challenges with greater knowledge and confidence. And so now. Enjoy this conversation with my dear friend, Lisa. so 

lisa and I were in grad school together. We studied drama therapy at NYU. Are we allowed to say that?  

Lisa: Are we allowed to curse also?  

Bree: Oh, totally. 

Okay. Great. How can we talk about menopause and not curse?  

Lisa: Because I just was telling a friend and. Yeah, I'm doing this interview with,uh, NYU cohort. And because I was old as fuck when I went to graduate school, I'm like a decade ahead of a lot of people. So maybe something I say might be helpful  

Bree: to someone.[00:04:00]  

Lisa: I was like 40 years old almost when we, when we were in grad school together. 

Crazy, whatever how, whatever age you were, you brought so much to the program. And I  

Bree: loved going on that particular adventure with you. And I'm really. Happy to have you as a  

guide for me and for the listeners for this next part, because the truth is like, one of the things I love about you is you don't suffer fools and you tell it like it is, and this is a place when we're talking about perimenopause and menopause, we need more of that shit.  

Lisa: We do, we do more of that. I could have used.  

Bree: There are two things that motivated me to do this whole, series because pause to go and long-term. 

It will be about transitioning. I'm a coach. all of my clients are going through transitions. I mean, there's no, no one. Who's not right. And over the last couple of months, I've been in a[00:05:00] mastermind and I've had 53 new clients, Lisa. Wow. And, and most of them have been perimenopausal or have recently been through menopause and. 

And I realized that I didn't know shit and I'm there and I don't know  

Lisa: it. And so,  

Bree: Thank goodness in the last couple of years, there've been more books that have come out about it. Really great resources, some more podcasts, but I really wanted to do a whole  

Lisa: season. 

Yeah.  

Bree: And I wanted the season to be. Experts who are medical experts, people who are really specializing in self care and coaching and taking care of ,taking care of the whole woman  

as they go through menopause. And then also to really have women who are willing to talk about their experiences and that [00:06:00] is you. 

Lisa: I just love to talk about my experiences all day long. I have so many 

pick a topic.  

I have experiences. I'm glad . It's needed. It's necessary because you know, it's not a journey of menopause. It's like a journey of womanhood. Like it's it's and much like, like, oh, girls get their period. Well, yeah, but in all different kinds of ways, and it says unique to each individual, you know, it's not just a blanket thing that kind of happens. 

It happens uniquely to each person. So you can't just be like, oh, they got their period. You know, it's like, no, there's a lot that goes on with that. Or they stop their period or whatever, you know, it's, it's a journey of womanhood.  

Bree: It is. So let's go actually back to starting your period, right? Because it's hard to talk about stopping your period without talking about starting your period. 

 We know that there's not been enough information out about menopause. Did you feel like you [00:07:00] were prepared to start your period? What was that like  

Lisa: for you? I wasn't at all and I had my mom. I was a late in life baby. So about the time I started my period, my mom was in menopause. and I learned just like we're doing right here. 

I learned everything about my period from my friends who were getting their. Like my mom way too late, came up to me with like some 1950s belt and pad that had like the little clips on it. And I'm already using tampons, you know? I'm like, I got it. I got it. We're good. Like I, I suffered pads for like, Hmm, two or three periods. 

And I was like, this is not gonna work for me at all. Like this lump of cloth, you know, and I'm kind of bodily shaped in my hips and stuff and they just never worked for me. And I was happy to do tampons, like as soon as I could. no, it was a little bit of a shock [00:08:00] and, Kind of gross and embarrassing, you know, just like this, some sort of brownish residue in my pants. 

And I couldn't really figure out what, but I had enough friends that had started their period. I was about 12, 12, 13, 13, yeah. Right around in there. And I pretty much had an easy go through the whole time I was menstruating. You know, I just had a regular period. I had a couple days of flow, nothing intense, nothing like what a lot of my friends went through. 

I did not have really PMs. I was, I was, so it would have been in the mid. Seventies when I started my period. So about the time I was getting ready to have sex, I had a good excuse to get on the pill, which hadn't been around for that long, already at this time. So I was like, I need to regulate my period, you know, so it was a good time to get on the pill. 

That's how it was explained to my mother, so we didn't have to talk about that other [00:09:00] thing, which was sex. We didn't have to talk about that either. And, the pill didn't really work for me for very long. , I had a lot of emotional reactions to the pill. I know it's much better now, but, so I was off. 

 And on the pill for years just cause I couldn't really tolerate it, but my period was just kind of normal. I had it like every month, like clockwork, two or three days I had no PMs. I had no endometriosis, like, you know, all these things that my friends suffered through. I just didn't really have,  

 Like many things in life. I forgot about it every month to like, for some reason, you know, I had this thing for like 40 years right. But it would surprise me every single month. It'd be like, why am I so achy? Why am I so tired? 

Oh my God, I'm bleeding. okay. You know, like I never like monitored, you know, it was just, and I forgot about. I still forget about it. Like I walked down a tampon aisle and I'm like, wow, I did that for like 40 some years. And I don't think about it. [00:10:00] I hear childbirth is like that also. 

Bree: Yeah, I bet you forget. What's painful about 

Lisa: like, when you're done, you're like, I'm  

Bree: never doing this again. It is true you were there. I mean, you weren't in the hospital, but you were around with my first pregnancy and, and when my first daughter was born and that was fine. , but this was my second pregnancy. 

I had this kid and both were C-sections for a multitude of reasons that are fit for another podcast. And, after the second one, I turned to Jeff and I said, you are welcome to have another kid. But not with me done done.  

so yeah, I get that. And so you were not a tracker like now there's this whole I have now that baby and, and her little sister are now 16 and  

Lisa: 20. So gorgeous, well done,  

Bree: fierce women, fierce women, and they track right there, all these apps, there are all these things to do it. It's so different from, [00:11:00] from us growing up. 

Lisa: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just a surprise every month 

Bree: I'm curious to know if you felt the same way I felt like I kind of knew. I mean, I went to an all girls boarding school and, and I had a lot of girlfriends, I felt like I pretty much knew a lot about menstruation and periods and felt like I could joke about it and all of that. But now. As I see my kids, I see. 

I carried a lot of shame even then just like not wanting people to see that you had a tampon in the bottom of your purse,  

Lisa: right? Like that was a real  

Bree: thing. Maybe even still is on some level. Right. And my kids are like "here's a tampon!!!", 

Lisa: right, right. Yeah.  

Bree: Did you have that too? Did you  

Lisa: have that? Oh yeah. Yeah. Hide it when you're taking it to the bathroom, because I don't know. I don't know. I mean, I don't really know. I didn't feel like [00:12:00] I had a lot of shame around what period I felt like it was an inconvenience. 

That's what it felt like more than anything. and I must've had some because I would hide things like that too, but it never, I don't feel like I actively felt it. It was probably more of like a subconscious thing, but mostly it just felt like an inconvenience. Cause sometimes it kept me from, having sex depending on the partner or whatever, you know? 

So, Yeah, it just felt like there was a couple of days I had  

to like, be like, ah, this is going to be a drag. 

Bree: I mean, that's sort of the, the, the basic feeling around periods often is it's a drag. 

Yeah. Which is. So  

Lisa: interesting, right? Like cuts into your fund  

Bree: that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Instead of, instead of being something that can even be positive and cleansing, or remind us to slow down and get in touch with our bodies, because we're [00:13:00] operating in a world that was designed for men, right. It wasn't. So of course it's. 

Because it didn't fit the culture we were in. Right. 

 When do you think you first became aware of, perimenopause or menopause for you? Like what happened  

Lisa: in retrospect? I know it was about the time I was at NYU. So my late thirties, early forties, mostly just, my periods got lighter. 

and I had, I was sweating at night, which was just so new for me. I was like, what is going on? Like, I wasn't really sure what was happening, but just sweating while I slept. And that was about it for. Three years or so, and I was also trying to get pregnant at that time. I had decided, and this is really interesting. 

Lisa: I had never wanted to have kids. Ever not in my wheelhouse, [00:14:00] no desire. When I hit perimenopause. It's like my biological clock was screaming at me. That's why, when I have friends that are younger than I am, who are like, I just want to have a kid. I'm like, you know what? Good wait a couple of yearsand I was going, I was getting my, you know, hormones checked and , FSH and Nala hormones population. And like, I was serious. I was looking into sperm donors, cause I didn't have a boyfriend at the time. And, and like I was on it and it, to me that is just like pure biological, like. 

Nothing I thought of or planned on it was like, boom, boom, boom. For about two or three years, I was like that. And then it went away, just went away like  

Bree: that. So for you, one of the first stages was actually this like insatiable desire to breed. Yeah. To make a kid. Yeah, it  

Lisa: was crazy. Yeah.  

Bree: And I have to [00:15:00] say, I know that feeling I'm there right now. 

I don't want to have another kid. It's very clear. Like, I, I think I just made that clear, but I'm obsessed with babies. I'm obsessed. And I think, it. made more sense when people were having children younger and by the time they were hitting menopause, new babies were coming along. 

They can help. 

And that lasts like quick squeeze, one  

Lisa: out, squeeze one out. Right. There's a few of us left in here. 

 All of my hormone levels were so low. And during that time I did meet someone who I'm now married to. And so I wasn't using any birth control, hoping to get pregnant. And then, twice I got, I got pregnant twice. When I pretty much was beginning menopause. 

I got pregnant twice. Neither of them were viable, but while I was about 48 or 49 at that time, so we were both just stunned because it's like we've been having sex for like six years thinking nothing. And the [00:16:00] first pregnancy we were excited. And the second one, we were like, wow, we really dodged a bullet at that time. 

We're like, oh God. But it was just, you know, the irony behind all of it was just like, what the fuck? Like what is happening? Yeah. It was crazy. That's  

Bree: intense. Yeah. And you were a late in life, baby,  

Lisa: right? Yes. I wasn't late in life, baby. My mom had me when she was 40. Yeah. Yeah. So the perimenopause started late thirties, early forties with just the intense desire to have a baby that I'd never ever, ever, ever had before. 

And I'm sweating at night. Yeah. And then it kind of changed when I came back to Florida. So I was about 46 and I was getting ready to get married. And I started having, do you know what, PMDD is? Can you tell us peri-menopausal dysphoric disorder? Well, [00:17:00] actually it's premenstrual dysphoric disorder, but it happens a lot in peri-menopause. 

Bree: Okay. And what does that mean? It  

Lisa: means, it's like PMs ramped up. So I realized that I was, having these really intense, emotional things happen . I was still getting my  

period, but it was like really light. It was like a day of, very little. And, but about 10 days prior, it was almost like I had really bad PMs, like. 

A little while to figure out what was going on. And, and then I started having suicidal ideation, like really bad. like I'd be, you know, at this really happy time in my life, I'd be like, oh, we're out on the boat. I just wish this boat would crash and I would die, but everybody else would live. 

That's kind of, and I'm like, what, what is that? You know? So I went and saw a psychiatrist. He's [00:18:00] like, oh, you have this and we'll put you on some SSR eyes, you know, some antidepressants and it lifted, but it was pretty intense. It was pretty, you know, I just didn't know what was happening and I, I, I really do,  

Bree: you know, ascribe all of it to  

Lisa: just this  

Bree: transition. 

Lisa: I have to say, I have a history, a long history with anxiety and depression. So this was just that like, like a Mack truck hitting me, you know?  

Bree: Something that I've read a bit about  

Lisa: That it, we have, 

Bree: any kind of mood disorders that sometimes they are exacerbated during that time. And if we have no history of mood disorders that sometimes we develop them for the first time during that time. I've also read and again, I am not a medical professional, but I've also read that for the most part. 

They seem to resolve after menopause. So, so one year after the final period, by [00:19:00] then it's mostly begun that then you enter into. And are you, are you, are you there yet? I don't know where you are in your process.  

Lisa: I don't know where I am. so I did that for about a year, and felt better and went off the medication and then the real sort of menopause symptoms. 

And I don't even know what to call them. Really started hitting me about my mid fifties. So, Still bleeding, but I had all of these other symptoms, like, you know how they say you get dry skin? You know, I'm an unusual symptom person. I'm like, you know, when they go in and really rare instances, this happens, I'm the rare instances person always have been. 

I there's something called formication. Do you know what? This is? No formication like for fornication, but within. Is when you have the sensation that bugs are crawling under your skin. Oh, [00:20:00] so I know you might not want to ever air this three because it just makes terrify people. But again, I was like, I haven't heard this and believe me, I've been reading the books. 

Lisa: Like I've been reading. Kristin. I've been, you know, Dr. Kristin, I'm reading you, you know what fuck. So, I was having these symptoms of like, I'm still getting my period, very light, like hardly worth anything. Feelings that I was getting about, and this is not an exaggeration. I was probably getting about 30 hot flashes a day. 

Like I was just continually and I also know stress brought them on and I was working in a high school for kids with developmental and intellectual delays. So I was like stressed all day long. I want to tear off my clothes and jump out and went and it's very distracting. I mean, people really don't understand. 

You know, hot flushes or hot flashes do, which is, it just totally [00:21:00] distracts you from whatever moment you're in. Cause you're just like, I am burning from the inside out and burning alive right now. I can't even hear what you're saying because I'm, you know, so the, the three big ones for me were the form of case. 

The  

Bree: bugs crawling under your skin?  

Lisa: Yeah, but's crawling under my skin. It was unbelievable. It wasn't just like itchy dry skin. It was like, things were moving in there. It was so bizarre. , you know, so many hot flashes. I couldn't even. Begin to count them. And then, my cognitive, issues started to happen where, I thought I had Alzheimer's or something. 

I was terrified. I couldn't read really anymore. I could only read, like, I'd sit down to read just a magazine or something and I would read one sentence. And then I start on and then I have to go back and I would read the sentence again and I would read the sentence again. I couldn't, add sort of like any math things were really hard. 

And, [00:22:00] and then also my conversational skills dropped significantly. I was monosyllabic basically. And I was terrified. And the only thing that helped me was talking to another woman who said, oh, I had some of those. And I went to see this woman, doctor, I will never have another male doctor in my life ever, ever, ever. 

I don't care unless it's a surgeon or something, will not see male doctors anymore. Something happened at, you know, around 50 where this sort of weird dismissive things started happening and, you know, we hear about it, but yeah. So, and I'm like, I'm an intelligent, attractive woman. 

Like, why don't you see me? And, she said, I'm going to see this gynecologist, a young woman, smart as all hell. And she took all my hormone levels. and she said, you have zero testosterone. And I was like, oh, cause I was waiting for [00:23:00] estrogen dips and for gesture and you know, all that stuff. 

And I had for about a year. Been over the counter medicating with the, I don't know what it is that the over the counter stuff like for gesture and creams that I could buy over the, you know, I was doing all the cream. Yeah. I was doing all my research on like menopause that and what can I do? What can I do? 

and. what were those things? Oh, they're very popular Estroven, Estroven. And they did help a little bit, a little bit, but she said, yeah, You know, you're having cognitive issues because you have no testosterone know. She was like, and usually there's about like 3% is low and you have none. 

Lisa: And she put me on bio identical hormones that I get at a compounding pharmacy. And like the next day I was like, back on, it was like a miracle to me. And I've been on those for about five years. So that's why I'm telling you. I don't know where I am because I haven't gone off of them to [00:24:00] see where I am, but I'm not getting my period. 

I haven't had my period for like five years. Stop stop getting it when I went on the  

Bree: hormones.  

So of course everybody is different, right? So we're not saying everybody needs to go on testosterone, but. Did you find that all of those that said the, the brain fog, the hot flashes, the skin crawling, all of that stopped once you started testosterone. Yup. Yay. Thank goodness for modern science and good doctors and a good friend. 

Lisa: This, if this is like, you know, it's from somebody talking to me and saying, oh, this is who I see. And she did this for me. What happened with me was different than what happened with my friend. But at least it was a doctor who I could talk to. And when I went to see my GP, my male GP, during those years, he frowned on it, like, and I was like, yeah, you're going to have to take my right arm before you convince me to not do this. 

And then a [00:25:00] couple years later, he must've gotten educated because,  

Bree: he changed his tune. Well, that's also part of this too, right? It really does take courage to speak up and advocate for yourself, with your doctor. It's it's not easy. And, and as women, I feel like we are often. 

Our perspective is trivialized. I mean, I, I have been in a doctor's office and seeing I have a great doctor now. So current doctor, I don't want you to feel like I'm talking about you, but I have been in a doctor's office and seen like a true eye roll, you know, like you are crazy. Yeah. so the sexism that is there, that is it's cultural, right? 

 and it's in our education system. It's, it's in our political system, it's in our insurance system. It's everywhere. Right? So we are, so it takes some extra. Extra ovaries. 

Lisa: That's what those little legs were in there. 

so, so [00:26:00] now that you're on the other side of it, I I'm really curious because you touched on something that 

Bree: I have to say I'm kind of fascinated with, because I'm hoping it can be a superpower. I know that I am probably naive in thinking this, but this idea of having some of having visibility of being invisible, which is threatening right. 

When we  

Lisa: depended on. 

Bree: Our, our identity as young fertile women and strong fertile women. Right. Whatever for that to then be completely displaced. I don't know if it is completely displaced, I guess that's my question for you. Can you tell me more about that notion?  

Lisa: I feel like. You know, I'm lucky because I have a husband who's quite a bit younger than I am. 

So, well lucky and not [00:27:00] lucky because there's a lot of times I'm like, oh Jesus Christ. Like,  

Bree: I'm going to be  

Lisa: 60 and I'm not looking like I did when you met me when I was 40, you know, cause forties good forties, a good can. That's a good decade. Then you get to 50 and then you're like, whew. I feel like, oh shit, this is not for sissies. 

and it, I felt it more just in the general public, I think. And sometimes, yeah, it's great. The invisibility is great. And then sometimes it's not when. You want to be heard, and part of that journey for me, Has been the, just the journey of letting though and understanding like there are generations behind me that are now having their turn. 

Lisa: And I would like to become more. I have definitely become more of a [00:28:00] mentor and really taking on that role. Like my ambition. Probably gone to zero. And I don't mean that in a bad way. I mean that in the best way possible, like I have nothing to prove to anyone anymore. And, and if you don't want what I have, I don't really care, you know? 

I have a lot to offer. And if there's someone that wants to take advantage of that or listen to that, like yourself or some other women out there, or whoever it is, I'm happy to offer it. But I have nothing that I'm trying to do anymore. Like nothing. And I mean that very literally like nothing like somebody, somebody asked me recently this, I hope they don't listen to this to help. 

Lisa: There was a chapter coming in a book for some of the work that I was doing with some other, creative art there. And I was like, you know, I've written my chapters and I do understand kind of how thankless the whole process [00:29:00] is like published, published. And I was like, I think that I will help you guys in the way of guidance, but I am not putting just like, it's not how I want to spend my time, but it's important that you guys get published, right? 

Like, You know, you just turned 40. Some of them are not even 40. Some of them are like 35. And so that is really, I liked that role a lot. And the other thing that happens is, oh shit, I just lost it.  

Bree: Cause that's what  

Lisa: happens. but I liked that role a lot and also, oh, it'll come to me.  

Bree: It'll come to me. 

I, I love this idea of moving from a position of proving oneself and striving and, and trying to accomplish things , being productive in a way that's, [00:30:00] you know what I mean? I do moving from that to this place. Really legacy, right? Of how can we leave the world better than it was when we arrived? 

And I think women have to kind of lead the way on that, honestly. And that's in terms of, of how we take care of each other . And it's also environmental. And how are we taking care of. The earth, how are we taking care of a society? How are we managing the incredible inequities that we have in our culture? 

We can go way down there. And I say that menopause is a good start for that in many ways. because we're also having to speak up for ourselves. Not to prove ourselves to have a presence. We have a, we have a culture that essentially says. You as women are not valued once you are no longer having [00:31:00] kids, right? you're valuable when you look a certain way, when you have a certain body type, when you fulfill our male needs in a certain way. 

And it's an opportunity for us to. To step into more of the Maven role, right. Rather than the maiden or matron, to step into this Maven and later KRS-One roles of really, truly taking care of the things from a, from a different vantage point. I was talking to another guest and she talked about killer whales have that. 

There are only two species of animals that live beyond menopause and that have, females that live beyond menopause. And those are killer whales and humans. And that we play an [00:32:00] absolutely. Invaluable part in the structure of society by being here and we can have a good 50 years. Post-menopause right. 

Like we can have far more time after menopause than we had being fertile 

mind blown.  

Lisa: I, I think as, as far as society goes, yes, but also the internal journey for me, like when we talk about proving things, it's mostly for myself, that journey of like self-acceptance is huge. Like I remember when I was 30, how I looked at a 50 year old, you know, or when I went back, I taught, theater at USF for a few years. And I'm looking at these like 18 or 19 year old students. And I'm like, some of them have parents that are younger than I am, and  

Bree: I'm thinking. 

Back to when I was  

Lisa: 20, you know, and I was 50 something at this time, if I had a 40 year old professor, it was like they were ancient. So just [00:33:00] this, like wrapping my mind around this idea of self-acceptance for myself in the process, you know, is, Huge because of course I'm much more interested in myself than I am in society. 

You know,  

Bree: I love that. That's  

Lisa: another thing that's happened  

Bree: that you're more interested in yourself than in society. Yes. Yes. Tell me about that. Tell me more about that.  

Lisa: Well, it just, you know, the whole thing is a journey has been a journey of self-acceptance for me and, and this idea that. There's a lot of people that spend a lot of time trying to not age and it's like, but you are blanche, you know? 

And, and I am, and it's just that idea of trying to find where I'm comfortable each step of the way. And you know, this thing of losing ambitions or. In the best possible way is also for me not having to prove anything to [00:34:00] myself anymore, about how much I can do or how good I am, or am I the best, or am I doing my best? 

Even, it's like, if I'm showing up today, that's my best, you know, like, and so, you know, the physical and emotional stuff. I think I've kind of worked through that part of menopause, but I really liked this other side of it, where really, I really am just interested in myself and it also goes back to looking at what is coming, letting them take. 

It's like you're 20 or 30 or 40. It's your society now? Like it's yours, you're, you're running everything or you should be, and I'm happy to do that. And I'm happy to help where I can, but I don't feel the need to be on the front lines anymore. I'm more interested in myself and my piece of the, of the world and making the. 

What I want it to be, and you know, the best it can be, I guess, but, you [00:35:00] know, I don't have much, interest in those bigger things anymore. Which, you know, I did for a long time. I mean, I do, but it's from, it's almost like from a bird's-eye it's almost from like, I don't feel in it anymore. I mean, I'm still here, but I'm not driving it anymore, you know? 

and, and I'd like to help the people that are driving it, if they want. You know, like we've said, but I don't know I'm here for that. And I'm not, I'm not throwing myself out there anymore.  

Bree: You're sitting in the back of the limousine, given the directions to the chauffer or  

Lisa: not, or just wherever you want it. 

Bree: I I'd love to know how has, because you're married and you, and you have a younger husband. How has your relationship changed during perimenopause and then also in post-menopause,  

Lisa: well, you know, as I'm getting older, so is. And that's really fun [00:36:00] to be a part of too. 

And I think that, I know he probably, we didn't talk about it a lot, but he, you know, he probably had his own struggles and adjustments to make, to having an older wife and, you know, he's a real cutie. So, there's a lot of that in there. but I think as he's gotten older, I mean, I think the most endearing thing he says to me is you have to last, so we've finally gotten to a point where it's just like, you need to take care of your health. 

You need to keep moving around. You, you gotta, you gotta like. And so that's kind of where we are.  

Bree: Maybe we all have someone in our lives who says you have to last have to last.  

Lisa: We have a great relationship. I highly recommend it for anyone  

Bree: have, uh, age difference I mean, there are those worries that come along with that, especially as a woman, but there's also like we don't compete the way a lot of [00:37:00] couples do. We're not in any kind of competition with each other because we are at different places and we know we're at different places. so. He's very good at understanding my transitions and what I'm up for and what I'm not. 

Lisa: And you know, he's still at his place in life where it does matter what he's doing, you know, that he is, accomplishing and things like that. You know what I  

Bree: mean? I do. I do. And you, you all have some plans to go off grid, is that right? Yes.  

Lisa: I'm going to build a house in the mountains. 

And as you know, it's the best place you can be. Yes. And we're going to make our own little, we got about three acres and we're just going to, I say, it's our starter in our finisher.  

Bree: I love it. And what a beautiful place to disappear, you know?  

Lisa: Yeah. Exactly.  

Bree: Yeah. Yep. Fold into the mountains. Yeah.  

Yeah. [00:38:00] So before we wrap up, if you had to offer women who are just going into perimenopause, , one piece of advice, what would it be?  

go easy on yourself. And do everything you can to not suffer. You don't have to suffer. You just have to find the right, the right combination of either a doctor or, you know, you don't have to just suffer your way through it and get a good female support group. 

Lisa: I love that one. That's a bunch. 

Yeah. Find a good doctor that you trust that's up on, you know, oh, I didn't know what a compounding pharmacy was or did, you know, stuff like that. So find a doctor that's young and educated and, yeah, don't, don't suffer. You don't have to suffer through it.  

Bree: Awesome. Thank you. Thank you for sharing. 

Thank you so much. 

Lisa: Asking me, I hope I don't scare [00:39:00] people away. If you, you might listen to it and you're like, we can't, we can't put this on.  

Bree: It is scary. But the thing is that we actually need. We need to tell the scary stories, and we need to know, Hey, if you're having the scary feelings, you're not crazy,  

Lisa: right. 

This is really happening. This is really happening. Yeah. And your body is just going through so much, you know, Just like when they talk about when you're starting to get your period, you know, it's, it's, your body is going through so much and your hormones  

Bree: are going through so much  

Lisa: that you don't really have any control over, you know, but you also don't just have to like ride it out. 

Bree: Like there is help out there. Definitely. Yeah. It's weird. There's it's. I dunno. I'm glad you're doing this. Cause I think it's important. Here are my key takeaways from this conversation with Lisa. Number one, [00:40:00] find a doctor who is up to speed on perimenopause. Once Lisa found a physician who would listen to her and come up with a treatment plan that fit her specific needs. It was a total game changer. Number two, remember that you don't have to suffer. If you are having intense symptoms, talk to someone, find someone you trust and really talk about it.  

Number three. . Get a social support structure in place that can be in person. Online official groups, or just sitting around with your friends. Sharing our perspectives is a great way to contextualize our experiences.